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Topic: CFP Format- The Best 5 seeds in Recorded History?

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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #56 on: July 23, 2024, 06:49:36 PM »
Quote from: Kris60 on July 23, 2024, 06:36:18 PM
They were in a division where they had a better chance to win a NC.  They voluntarily chose to make the jump to FBS.  Why does that bother you?
A big lie that everyone is in on bothers me.

The 5 seed that worked hard and had a successful season, poised for a big, juggernaut challenge in the prestigious national championship playoff gets to face.......Memphis.  Or Liberty.  Or Tulane.

It sucks.  Yeah, it's an easy game, but it's lame.  Everyone else gets to play big-boy football and you don't.  

Just not a big fan of lying to each other with a wink and some cash.  I'm weird.
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FearlessF

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #57 on: July 23, 2024, 07:17:10 PM »
you hand me a big pile of cash and I'll wink and lie about it
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #58 on: July 23, 2024, 07:24:03 PM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on July 23, 2024, 06:49:36 PM
A big lie that everyone is in on bothers me.

The 5 seed that worked hard and had a successful season, poised for a big, juggernaut challenge in the prestigious national championship playoff gets to face.......Memphis.  Or Liberty.  Or Tulane.

It sucks.  Yeah, it's an easy game, but it's lame.  Everyone else gets to play big-boy football and you don't. 

Just not a big fan of lying to each other with a wink and some cash.  I'm weird.
No, not really. Okay, yeah, you ARE a little bit weird. But not for this :57:

The truth is that we have a system that is the haves and the have-nots. It is what it is. Your talent level is based on recruiting, not some sort of parity like you'd get with a draft. You previously had recruiting that was based on helmet status and "facilities", and now it's based on NIL, but either way it's not conducive to parity. Now we have NIL, but we don't have any sort of salary cap or anything else to enforce parity. Now we have free transfers with no sit-out penalty, so NIL will turn everything into the highest bidders getting the most talent, even if that talent starts at a smaller school. 

Yeah, it's a big effing lie. 

So let's scrap all this playoff bullshit and just turn it back into bowls. There's no playoff. There's no "national championship game". There's no semblance of objectivity. 10 schools every year can care about whether voters will crown them at the end of the year, and 120 schools every year can play for the dignity of trying to go to a bowl which is a worthy thing that shouldn't be minimized. 

We turned EVERYTHING in college football into being about the NC. That was the error, not letting some tallest pygmy into the proceedings to get slaughtered by a big boy football team. 
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Kris60

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #59 on: July 23, 2024, 07:31:06 PM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on July 23, 2024, 06:49:36 PM
A big lie that everyone is in on bothers me.

The 5 seed that worked hard and had a successful season, poised for a big, juggernaut challenge in the prestigious national championship playoff gets to face.......Memphis.  Or Liberty.  Or Tulane.

It sucks.  Yeah, it's an easy game, but it's lame.  Everyone else gets to play big-boy football and you don't. 

Just not a big fan of lying to each other with a wink and some cash.  I'm weird.
Sucks for who?  The 5 seed?  They don’t care.  You keep taking up fights for people who don’t want or need you to.  Liberty doesn’t feel insulted they are included in a playoff they can’t win. Blue bloods don’t care they might have to play a G5.

For whatever reason it bothers you and you keep projecting how you feel onto the teams involved, but  they don’t feel that way.
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FearlessF

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #60 on: July 23, 2024, 07:40:20 PM »
yup, we all know that seeding has been a farce since the first playoff

so, the #5 seed might have a bit of an advantage - does that mean that the #5 seed will come from the SEC EVERY season?

seeds #1 - #12 are gonna be assigned by a group of folks sitting around one table

the haves will get the advantages while the have-nots will get the shaft
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #61 on: July 23, 2024, 07:42:40 PM »
Quote from: Kris60 on July 23, 2024, 07:31:06 PM
Sucks for who?  The 5 seed?  They don’t care.  You keep taking up fights for people who don’t want or need you to.  Liberty doesn’t feel insulted they are included in a playoff they can’t win. Blue bloods don’t care they might have to play a G5.

For whatever reason it bothers you and you keep projecting how you feel onto the teams involved, but  they don’t feel that way.
They're not reading this, lol.  I'm just sharing my thoughts, same as everyone else.
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #62 on: July 23, 2024, 07:52:11 PM »
Quote from: FearlessF on July 23, 2024, 07:40:20 PM
yup, we all know that seeding has been a farce since the first playoff

so, the #5 seed might have a bit of an advantage - does that mean that the #5 seed will come from the SEC EVERY season?

seeds #1 - #12 are gonna be assigned by a group of folks sitting around one table

the haves will get the advantages while the have-nots will get the shaft
The 5 seed will be the top team that wasn't their conference champ. 

Over the past few years, that suggests it'll either be the loser of the Michigan/OSU game or the top SEC team that isn't conf champ. I'd say "Bama" but w/o Saban we don't know what's going to happen there. 

And frankly we've seen more than a few seasons where the team who didn't win their conference due to a weird loss somewhere is stronger than the team that DID win their conference, so often the team seeded at #5 is going to be within the top 3 ranking-wise. I suspect they will be more often than not REALLY strong teams. Stronger than at least 1-2 of the conference champs who are seeded ahead of them. 
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FearlessF

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #63 on: July 23, 2024, 08:06:11 PM »
Quote from: betarhoalphadelta on July 23, 2024, 07:52:11 PM
The 5 seed will be the top team that wasn't their conference champ.

Over the past few years, that suggests it'll either be the loser of the Michigan/OSU game or the top SEC team that isn't conf champ. I'd say "Bama" but w/o Saban we don't know what's going to happen there.

And frankly we've seen more than a few seasons where the team who didn't win their conference due to a weird loss somewhere is stronger than the team that DID win their conference, so often the team seeded at #5 is going to be within the top 3 ranking-wise. I suspect they will be more often than not REALLY strong teams. Stronger than at least 1-2 of the conference champs who are seeded ahead of them.
so, an SEC team

that team would have been Georgia last season
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Brutus Buckeye

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #64 on: July 23, 2024, 08:43:27 PM »
With NIL it's not completely inconceivable that a G5 team could build a championship roster. Like if BYU hadn't joined the Big 12, and if their parent church or a bunch of rich donors decided to go all in and bankroll every good player in the country. Unlikely, but no longer unimaginable. 
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FearlessF

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #65 on: July 23, 2024, 09:16:42 PM »
the SEC would never allow it
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Cincydawg

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #66 on: July 24, 2024, 08:50:36 AM »
The G5 inclusion is entirely a legal issue, nothing else.  The scheme used to have the top SIX conference champions included by fiat.  I noted this a while back and expected them to change it.  They did, now it's top five.  Fine with me.

There will of course be years when the top G5 team isn't a 12 seed, but maybe a 10 seed, and the 12 seed will be some left over P5 (P4) team that still is better than 8 teams the 5 seed has played all year.  And the 5 seed will lose that game every once in a while, maybe more often than folks expect.
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utee94

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #67 on: July 24, 2024, 09:03:24 AM »
Quote from: FearlessF on July 23, 2024, 09:16:42 PM
the SEC would never allow it

SEC can't do anything about it.  This is effectively the Oregon model.  They're not a helmet, and until just this year they were in a conference that's been largely irrelevant in football for decades.  Not really much different than a G5.

And yet through massive cash infusions from a single donor, they're out-rostering tons of the big boys.

The SEC hasn't been able to stop it so far, no reason to believe they could do anything going forward.
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Cincydawg

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #68 on: July 24, 2024, 09:23:37 AM »
I really do think the NIL thing is going to change the landscape of CFB over the next decade.  The top power teams of today would look entirely familiar to anyone in 2000, or 1980, maybe with the exception of Oregon (interesting exception).  In a decade, the top ten "power teams" could well include a TCU or Baylor or Indiana or ... X, and 3-4 of them.

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: CFP Format- Why #5 Is An Advantage
« Reply #69 on: July 24, 2024, 09:34:02 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 24, 2024, 09:23:37 AM
I really do think the NIL thing is going to change the landscape of CFB over the next decade.  The top power teams of today would look entirely familiar to anyone in 2000, or 1980, maybe with the exception of Oregon (interesting exception).  In a decade, the top ten "power teams" could well include a TCU or Baylor or Indiana or ... X, and 3-4 of them.
In all honesty, I wonder if it's more likely to happen in basketball than football. With roster sizes being so much smaller, a billionaire can more easily stack a roster than in CFB. 

Think Mark Cuban as an example. Not that Indiana is a patsy in basketball, of course, but they haven't hung a banner since the 80's. Cuban is definitely a fan, and definitely can afford the NIL outlays. What will it take, $15-20M per year to simply outbid everyone else in the sport for both starters and backups?

You might need to spend an order of magnitude more to truly lock up all the top talent in football across a roster of 85+ guys. 
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