2024-2025 B1G Basketball Thread

[betarhoalphadelta]

This is a weird thing, but it popped to mind when I was looking at the UW roster.

Basically, I’m not the biggest fan of when Wisconsin is “deep.” Like they played 11 guys last year, in part because the bottom 4-5 weren’t consistent or well-rounded enough to really lock down jobs. Sort of like you’d prefer one guy who can do lots of things compared to specialists. It seems like if you play five guys off the bench, in some ways it means you don’t trust a few, as compared to just three guys you know you can rely on.

I have some examples, but was wondering if I’m alone in this (just preferring a tight, really competent rotation of like 8 or so guys). The counterpoint would be Izzo, and I’d be interested in how @ELA saw it. It seems like Tom always wants to test out three centers per half, plus some other folks.

I haven't thought about this deeply, but I can give you my gut reaction...

• If you play 6 guys, you don't trust your bench.
• If you play 11 guys, you don't trust your starters.
• If you play 8 guys, you've got guys on your bench that are talented enough that you play them to keep your starters from getting fatigued by playing too many minutes. 

Something like that. 

[medinabuckeye1]

I saw this, thought it might be of some interest:

https://www.insidethehall.com/2024/07/02/heres-how-every-big-ten-program-stacks-up-in-kenpom-since-1997/

• 6 MSU
• 12 UCLA
• 13 tOSU
• 17 WI
• 18 PU
• 19 M
• 20 IL
• 22 UMD
• 23 IU
• 24 OR
• 34 USC
• 46 Iowa
• 51 WA
• 67 MN
• 77 RU
• 79 PSU
• 82 UNL
• 88 NU

[bayareabadger]

I haven't thought about this deeply, but I can give you my gut reaction...

• If you play 6 guys, you don't trust your bench.
• If you play 11 guys, you don't trust your starters.
• If you play 8 guys, you've got guys on your bench that are talented enough that you play them to keep your starters from getting fatigued by playing too many minutes.

Something like that.

I think that’s the right track. The 11 thing is interesting because it feels like it goes a few ways.

Often it means you have like 2-3 good starters and just weird platoons/a few true backups.

For UW this year, there was a weird blend of a former starter who got jumped and kinda a mess in the frontcourt where people could do something, but not enough.

At PF and center, UW had three backups, one center who could only play center (he was up and down) and two power forwards. One power forward is an ace 1-on-1 defender, but terrible as a shooter and finisher. They other was nominally a better shooter (his shots felt like they might go in, even though they usually didn’t), but he was sub-average on defense and mostly played against more inert players like Mason Gillis. (The PF thing was also more of a pain point because the starter was good but couldn’t shoot and got in a lot of foul trouble. So the backups played a bit more and there were spacing issues with the starter and best back up).

There have been plenty of badgers good enough to back up both center and PF or play PF/shoot well enough to slide the starting PF to center. But because of limited skill sets and ability, you end up plugging in pretty incomplete guys.

[FearlessF]

[ELA]

I'm surprised that tournament doesn't do better.  It's a generally crappy field.

Hawaii over Thanksgiving = arguably the best MTE
Hawaii over Christmas = equal to the MAC Tournament

[847badgerfan]

From 247

I haven't checked in lately, but last I heard, we may or may not see Andrija Vukovic for a few months.

Wisconsin signed the 20-year-old Serbian in May. The Badgers were hoping Vukovic would back up senior center Steven Crowl this season.

From what I'm told, there's a lot of stuff that needs to happen before Vukovic can enter the states. The biggest obstacle right now is an English competency test. 


Then, the Badgers also need to get Vukovic into school, which might be the biggest hurdle given he's been playing professional basketball the last few seasons. 

As we all know, the university does not give an inch when it comes to enrollment for athletes.

[medinabuckeye1]

Ohio State released 10 of their 11 non-conference games and the conference opponents (though not the dates) have been released so Ohio State's 2024/25 schedule is now just one game from being complete:

OOC:

• Mon 11/4 N, Texas in Vegas
• Mon 11/11 H, YSU
• Fri 11/15 A, aTm
• Tue 11/19 H, Evansville
• Fri 11/22 H, Campbell
• Mon 11/25 H, Green Bay
• Fri 11/29 H, Pitt
• Tue 12/17 H, Valpo
• Sat 12/21 N, Kentucky at MSG in NYC
• Sun 12/29 H, Indiana State

Conference:

• @ IU
• vs IU
• @ UMD
• vs UMD
• @ UNL
• vs UNL
• vs Iowa
• vs Michigan
• vs MSU
• vs NU
• vs OR
• vs RU
• vs WA
• @ IL
• @ MN
• @ PSU
• @ PU
• @ UCLA
• @ USC
• @ WI

Now here it is based on last year's NET rankings:

• #3 Purdue, Away
• #13 Illinois, Away
• #18 Kentucky, Neutral
• #21 Wisconsin, Away
• #24 MSU, Home
• #28 Indiana State, Home
• #30 Texas, Neutral
• #33 UNL, Away
• #33 UNL, Home
• #40 Pitt, Home
• #45 aTm, Away
• #53 NU, Home
• #59 OR, Home
• #62 Iowa, Home
• #69 Washington, Home
• #82 UMD, Away
• #82 UMD, Home
• #86 Penn State, Away
• #88 USC, Away
• #89 MN, Away
• #98  IU, Away
• #98 IU, Home
• #103 RU, Home
• #107 UCLA, Away
• #131 YSU, Home
• #133 M, Home
• #203 Evansville, Home
• #227 Green Bay, Home
• #302 Valpo, Home
• #304 Campbell

I'm reasonably happy with the OOC: 

• Kentucky is obviously a blueblood. 
• ISU was good last year (no idea what they have coming back).
• Texas is a good program for us to play (similarly situated in being a state 'flagship' that is clearly more into football but has a decent BB history). 
• Pitt is a good program and local enough that they'll bring some fans and Buckeye fans can travel there for the return game next year. 
• aTm is an ok series but I'd rather have Texas or Florida or Oklahoma. 
• YSU makes sense because you need some cupcakes and they are in-state so they'll bring some fans.  I knew a lot of YSU grads that were mostly all Ohio State fans nationally but YSU fans locally so for them, going to Columbus for a YSU/tOSU BB game is a win/win.  Either their alma-mater wins or the school they root for wins. 
• Evansville makes no sense to me.  It is in Indiana which is a neighboring state but Evansville is in the far SW corner of Indiana so it is a 5+ hour drive that I'm guessing nearly none of their fans will make. 
• Green Bay is worse than Evansville.  Worse team and further away. 
• Valparaiso is in the NW corner of Indiana, practically a Chicago suburb and 4.5 hours from Columbus so almost as far as Evansville and a worse team. 
• Campbell is a horrible team and in NC so not remotely close enough to expect a meaningful number of their fans to make the trek to Columbus. 

There are PLENTY of in-state small-conference schools:

• #23 Dayton
• #37 Cincy
• #108 Akron
• #130 Toledo
• #131 YSU (already on schedule)
• #139 OhioU
• #171 Kent
• #196 Cleveland State
• #228 Bowling Green (hi @SuperMario )
• #238 Miami, OH

Dayton or Cincy might well demand a H&H but I think the others would be thrilled to play in Columbus for the typical fee.  If Ohio State has some hang-up about playing in-state schools for recruiting reasons or whatever fine, make a deal with Michigan or MSU:  We'll host three three directional-Michigan's, they host three Ohio MAC schools. 

[bayareabadger]

From 247

I haven't checked in lately, but last I heard, we may or may not see Andrija Vukovic for a few months.

Wisconsin signed the 20-year-old Serbian in May. The Badgers were hoping Vukovic would back up senior center Steven Crowl this season.

From what I'm told, there's a lot of stuff that needs to happen before Vukovic can enter the states. The biggest obstacle right now is an English competency test.


Then, the Badgers also need to get Vukovic into school, which might be the biggest hurdle given he's been playing professional basketball the last few seasons.

As we all know, the university does not give an inch when it comes to enrollment for athletes.

Sometimes that writer posts stuff it just leaves me incredibly suspect. And for some reason that post does that.

At this point, I’m kind of fascinated to see if that kid is anything next season.

[847badgerfan]

If he even makes it to the team. Nobody knows anything really.

[bayareabadger]

If he even makes it to the team. Nobody knows anything really.

I guess it’s the phrasing they were “hoping” he’d back up Crowl. 

Like does that mean they hoped he’d be a backup that mattered? Does hope mean they lightly planned on it? Or was he a flier and they thought, “if it all comes together, maybe …”

The writer just has a bit of a message boarder’s outlook and precision, which sometimes leads to some lack of clarity. 

[medinabuckeye1]

Ohio State released 10 of their 11 non-conference games and the conference opponents (though not the dates) have been released so Ohio State's 2024/25 schedule is now just one game from being complete:

I'm confused, could someone who understands the NCAA BB scheduling rules better than I do please explain this to me:

Last year Ohio State played 31 games before the B1G Tournament but that included a 3-game MTE (WMU, Bama, Santa Clara).  

This seems to be the norm.  Similarly, Purdue played 31 games before the B1G Tournament including a 3-game MTE (Gonzaga, Tennessee, Marquette).  

I thought you had to play a MTE in order to play 31 regular season games.  Is that incorrect?  

[medinabuckeye1]

I'm confused, could someone who understands the NCAA BB scheduling rules better than I do please explain this to me:

Last year Ohio State played 31 games before the B1G Tournament but that included a 3-game MTE (WMU, Bama, Santa Clara). 

This seems to be the norm.  Similarly, Purdue played 31 games before the B1G Tournament including a 3-game MTE (Gonzaga, Tennessee, Marquette). 

I thought you had to play a MTE in order to play 31 regular season games.  Is that incorrect? 

Bump because I'm sure someone here knows the answer to this question and I'd like to know.  

[bayareabadger]

I'm confused, could someone who understands the NCAA BB scheduling rules better than I do please explain this to me:

Last year Ohio State played 31 games before the B1G Tournament but that included a 3-game MTE (WMU, Bama, Santa Clara). 

This seems to be the norm.  Similarly, Purdue played 31 games before the B1G Tournament including a 3-game MTE (Gonzaga, Tennessee, Marquette). 

I thought you had to play a MTE in order to play 31 regular season games.  Is that incorrect? 

Apparently GB, Campbell and Evansville are part of the loosest MTE I’ve ever seen. 

[medinabuckeye1]

Apparently GB, Campbell and Evansville are part of the loosest MTE I’ve ever seen.

Thanks!

That is weird.  The  Ohio State page doesn't even mention anything about an MTE, it is just three consecutive home games:

• Evansville on Tuesday, November 19
• Campbell on Friday, November 22
• Green Bay on Monday, November 25

It just looked like three regular home games but apparently Evansville's next two games after visiting tOSU are home games against GB on Friday then Campbell on Sunday.  So instead of an 8-team MTE where winners play winners and losers play losers this appears to be a 4-team MTE where each of the four plays the other three.  Ohio State hosts all three.  Evansville visits tOSU and hosts the other two.  I'm assuming (not bothering to look it up) that GB and Campbell are playing each other so the host of that game hosts one and visits two while the visitor in that game visits all three.  

So the primary weakness of this year's tOSU schedule is that the MTE is a complete joke, three home cupcake games.  Compare to past years:

• 2023/4 MTE was Directional-Michigan at home then Bama and Santa Clara at a neutral site in N. Florida.  
• 2022/3 MTE was SDSU, Cincy, and TxTech in Maui
• 2021/2 MTE was Seton Hall and Florida in Ft. Meyers
• 2020/1 I can't really tell due to the Pandemic

Supposedly the final OOC game for 2024/5 will be a neutral site game against a Power Conference Team.  If so, then I like what appears to be the new structure which I *THINK* is:

• 20 League games (10 home, 10 away)
• 3 MTE games (I'm fine with this structurally but would obviously prefer the three opponents from either of the last two years)
• 3 Neutral Site games against Power Conference Teams
• 2 Power Conference H&H games (Pitt home, aTm away)
• 2 minor conference regional home games (Valpo, ISU)
• 1 in-state minor conference home game (YSU)

If it were up to me I'd replace Valpo and ISU with in-state opponents and try for a better MTE but overall not bad.   

I also think this is an interesting wrinkle and will hopefully sell a few extra tickets:

• The BB game against Campbell is on Friday, November 22 and will likely be in the evening.  That is the night before a home FB game against Indiana so I think they are hoping to sell some tickets to fans in town for the FB game.  
• The BB game against Pitt is on Friday, November 29 and will likely be in the evening.  That is the night before THE GAME at home so same thing.